Is it 2011? Are you for real? 2m after taxes and 300 for housing.
Just as a point of curiosity... which post are you referring to?
Secondly, what is your thought on "reasonable" for a Uni job?
Just a point of curiosity- are you a teacher, or do you just call yourself one? Or, are you just another facilitator of ESL?
I already schooled you and gave a reply that was perfectly succinct, your responses, and my reply were removed...
When are you going to wake up? droning on with your sour attitude just does not cut it.
I asked a legitimate question with no undertones of disrespect about what you think is a reasonable offer. Your response was rude and pathetic.
Why don't you skip the personal attacks and just answer the question. If you cannot do that I guess it will be obvious to all that you are unable to respond in a serious and respectful way.
teachkorea21, Just to let you know about the comment deletion...I saw your comment earlier this afternoon - thought it was a fair, thoughtful, and well researched response to Angel's periodic forum posts about teacher salaries. I don't think anyone on the mod team deleted it. I can tell you there was no intentional action on my part to remove it. Apologies for losing your comment - tried to retrieve it via Google cache, but it wasn't there.
I checked some site settings and had inadvertantly given users the option to delete comments on their own forum threads. Angel can let us know if he deleted it. I have left this option in place for classified ads, but removed it for forum posts.
Stay tuned for an explanation of why users can delete comments on their own classifieds, but not on forum posts.
Periodic- correct! Usually, I think it is vile to talk about money on the public forums, but people are getting naughtier. This is taking the piss and you know it. Offering 2000 salaries for 2011 is pathetic. Two mill and 300 key money, come off of it Jeoff . Are you on the same side?Exchange rates, inflation and key money have gone through the roof. How can they pay 10 year old salaries. It's wrong in my opinion!! I'm alright Jack types might not care, I do.
Nonsense, being a Smartalec is what you were and are about. Why put that in inverted commas? Why use terms like schooled, pathetic and droned? You and I live on different planets, at least mine is not L--seur-nus.
Simply pathetic, you do not further discourse, have chosen to not answer the simple question of what a reasonable Uni job condition would be.
The words from your own mouth have spelled out the sad little "planet" you live on.
You have resorted to personal attacks when I gave you a legitimate response your recourse was to delete it because you were afraid your lack of ability to respond would show just how unfortunate you really are.
The reality is that I do no know you and you do not know me. I have tried to have legitimate discourse and you resort to attacking anyone who disagrees with you. This is at least the second thread you have made personal attacks against me in rather than furthering the discussion, it would seem that you simply can not comment for lack of ability.
... find yourself at the bar alone regularly I guess, I cannot fix you, good luck and good riddance.
What a sob story.
You have resorted to personal attacks when I gave you a legitimate response your recourse was to delete it because you were afraid your lack of ability to respond would show just how unfortunate you really are.- hypocrite; a la pot and kettle black- find yourself at the bar alone regularly I guess, I cannot fix you, good luck and good riddance.- entirely preferable to a second with spent with some of the ignorant loosers about.
Here is your chance then, explain yourself.
"hypocrite; a la pot and kettle black"
What did I do that was hypocritical? I did not erase your post so how would I be the hypocrite... were you referring to yourself?
Like I said on the repayment of recruiter thread:
I have noticed your, can't think of anything good to say, don't have any real position to back up, just post a comment for the sake of posting style.
And I have to say I like it...
BTW- I am not here to answer your, or anyone else's posts. I am here to give my opinion. I have done so. Mine relates to the pathetic offers on some jobs about. Those are my thoughts, that's it. Take em or leave, it was my post. Why do you need more? Who are you? The manager has taken away deleting privileges, nevermind , so be it.
"Is it 2011? Are you for real? 2m after taxes and 300 for housing/"
You defecate and call in prised revelation...
Like so many of the sad saps who live and work here and take the piss out of every aspect of Korea, hagwans, Uni's the occasional non teacher, you think life has handed you lemons. Grow up. No body owes you anything. If you don't like how people respond to your posts... don't post, sit at the bar happily alone(your words, not mine).
Just my opinion.
You defecate and call in prised revelation.- hope it smells good, do us favor and put the pc right up, against your nose.
Like so many of the sad saps who live and work here and take the piss out of every aspect of Korea, hagwans, Uni's the occasional non teacher, you think life has handed you lemons.- love life here, love Korea and Koreans- no bones to grind with hakwans, check my previous posts, non teachers are irrelevant to me. I love lemons too!
Grow up. No body owes you anything. If you don't like how people respond to your posts... don't post, sit at the bar happily alone(your words, not mine).- Who said I didn't like responses, so long as they are interesting, intelligent and relevant, I'm OK. You must be bored; to go after someone as dull as me.
What do you think is reasonable compensation for such a job? Have you ever had such a job or other relevant experience that would qualify you to have a credible opinion?
hey reacher do ya think so!!!!!!!!!!!-
I reach at a university. My job is to prepare my students to finish their degrees at English-speaking universities abroad. I have some of the sharpest students I've encountered in Korea, and they seem to think that I'm a real teacher.
What do you think is reasonable compensation for such a job? Have you ever had such a job or other relevant experience that would qualify you to have a credible opinion?
BTW- I don't need to be a teacher, Uni teacher to know that the salary is outdated, check on Pusanweb old forums.
"Stay tuned for an explanation of why users can deleted comments on their own classifieds, but not on forum posts."
Yes, I'd be interested in an explanation. I'd like to know if someone posts a comment about a seller who has scammed or ripped them off. Giving classified posters the ability to erase comments is not really ethical IMO.
For those interested...Why users can moderate comments on classified ads, but not forum postshttp://koreabridge.net/discussion/policies-users-moderating-comments-their-posts
We have the option to delete comments. You gave us the right. You now want to retrieve these. Others delete at will and so will I. You make it seem like we delete comments that make us look silly. The comment was nonsense and lacked balance. Anybody can find the lowest paying job in the World and compare. It doesn't make you a rocket scientist. Well researched, give it a rest. I wouldn't mind if qualified teachers were posting about such things. I am not in the same position as the poster, so we do not compare, so reasonable for him and me is irrelevant. I'll delete on my posts if I don't like it, just like others do. Stick to the topic and you wont get deleted. You know what I think, it's clear.
According to the state of California I am a qualified teacher with an MA degree.
The topic was Uni salaries and my comment was about how Korea compare with Jobs in the U.S. and was supported with a live current link to a job being offered now.
And finally you are right, we are not in the same situation, I can support my arguments with cogent thought and direct explanation were you simply delete posts when your brain starts to steam...
Like I already said, pathetic... and others are starting to notice.
Give the monkey a peanut- it took you 10 years to notice my posts- bloody observant. Why do you Yanks think we care about your economy? Centre of the world, right? Isn't the Californian economy up shit's creek? No wonder salaries are rubbish. You worded that Masters business carefully. In other words, you are not a qualified teacher really, are you?Other people notice, funny you should mention that. We are not in an academic setting, why do I need figures, I have common(sense & knowledge).For all of your education, you haven't taken the time to research salaries ;on the old Pusanweb forums. Yawn Zzzzzzz.
The pay is slightly on the low side but it still works out to a base rate of about 57,000 an hour which is not bad. The absolute cream of the crop hakkwon job, one paying 3 million a month and 25 hours a week of work, only averages out to a base rate of a little less that 28,000 an hour.
Thanks for getting things back on-topic Dogarse. This thread has gone way beyond our normal tolerance for personal attacks.
Time to get back on track, so going forward please keep the comments focused on the topic not the person. Posts that contain insults or personal attacks will be removed.
Apologies for that Bossman. I'll try harder to bomb my battleships; get them into the porcelain bowl in future.
Hmm... By my count Angel has attacked besides myself, the state of California, and the Entire U.S. as a whole.
Seems fairly unbalanced to shut the argument there...
As for my "qualifications". I am a licensed teacher who has experience teaching in my field... and an MA in Education.
As for this topic:
Jobs in the U.S.
Here are 3 different jobs being offered right now in the U.S. whose pay are listed:
Job 1 Job 2 Job 3
The three jobs are listed and the pay ranges from $39k-$48K starting.
As I stated before subtract tax and the pay will be in range of $2300-$3300 per month. Now subtract housing and you see where this is going.
Pay is higher there and so are expenses. Since last time my post was deleted for being unreal(I compared only one offer) I have given three more jobs.
Jobs in Korea
Recently listed, 2.15 with a BA, 2.25 with an MA(none of the jobs in the U.S. would accept a BA since they will all have many applicants who have above the "basic" qualifications)
And finally the 300 housing. Sure it is a bit low but then they don't tax it so it. It is not income.
Perhaps you would care to clarify your rant about the quality of Korean job offers, but given my reading of your prior posts(this thread and several others), I figure you will just walk away.
So you know where I am from(Happy to be a Yank, "mate"), how about you fill us in on why Korean job offers are so bad.
As an aside.
I have been saying for years that Korean job offers are to low. However, since people keep coming and taking the jobs, they will stay that way(I get this knowledge from my BA in Business)... its called supply and demand.
How about check the rates just here in Korea, buddy. How about check the rates in OZ, Japan, Oman, SA, and other ESL countries. California- big economy ,even larger debt, who cares? Any sensible foreigner, wanting to stay here and make a fist of it, wouldn't post that. You obviously have no intention to stay, so being a Smart Alec is more important. That's why I sit alone in the bar. You are correct, you are right, it's a fantastic job offer. Well done on your promotion to serf-peon!
There you go again, no sense, no insight, no reasoning, just blather. My argument points exactly to why I am here, I feel that it is a reasonable way to support my family and lifestyle.
What have you added to this entire thread other than venom and spite. Good job, well done being one of the "special people" the other poster and Jeff were referring to. Enjoy the empty seats to your right and your left.
I stick to my opinion, and others here on Pusanweb, that some University jobs are paying year 2000, or thereabouts, in terms of salaries. I think that is outrageous. If I am wrong in your opinions, or others, so be it. I am sticking to this view. That some postings may be taking advantage of naivety and desperation of weaker people.
I don't have to quote; answer your demands. To be honest, you won't get me, to tell you ,what you want to hear, give up. Blimey, I'm not going to tell you what I think is a good salary, after all, you are the Business major and Master's man.
Perhaps you might enlighten us on theoretical ideas such as Demand and Supply, Marginal Utility, Fiscal Policy, JMK, Liquidity Preference and so on. I hadn't realizes that Economics had become an exact science. Tell that to the guys running California and the World right now. Hold that thought, and oh, adios, amigo.
I did tell California, I voted, and when it did not change, I decided their were greener pastures... If you could read you would already know that.
As you point out, I understand Economics and you do not, so here is a lesson for you that relates to this topic.
When Supply(plenty of people who need a job teaching English in this scenario) is at or above equilibrium with demand prices will stay steady if not be reduced. Given what you have said about Korean job offers being what they were i n 2000, it seems likely that:
The pay is not 2000 numbers but actually market adjusted numbers based on demand.
"I'm not going to tell you what I think is a good salary, after all, you are the Business major and Master's man."
For me, I gather several others, any pay that would put you to work and off this board is reasonable, lol.
Your brain is just steaming because you cannot think of another way to dodge legitimate replies to your rants.
I studied for a time in the UK- you were right about that. Never had a job in the UK, far too boring. Hated it there, the Brits were a little too racist, for my liking.(IMO)Work life- Got into the "net" business at time of the internet boom, everything was "start ups" and venture capital. Spent a long time in Davis nr., Sacremento . California has some nice areas there. When I had time, I used to hit the 101. Just head down to to Seal Beach,Santa Monica pier, Santa Barbera, Long Beach is OK, Sante Fe,Carmel by sea- where Clint Eastwood was the Mayor. Arizona also is cool and has some nice lake resort homes and of course Vegassssss!Food was good, miss Denny's, Chunky Cheese pizza and Popeyes.Usually, like to get to the track on my breaks. The track at L Al (Alimitos) was great, have you been ? I may have failed, a lot did. However, you can never take the sunshine out of my eyes, the waves off of my skin, and the sand out of my hair. Good times, margaritas, ole. Red liquorice, fresh orange juice and MTV raps, ye boy!!!
Marshall–Lerner condition- slightly more stimulating than reading this. First rule, 101 of economics; there are no exact rules, no exact people , no exact principles. Changes in demand, supply; and a change in demand or supply are other principles pal. Are you saying the Demand here is less than the Supply? Who needs who more?Mountain to Mohammed or vice versa.
Do you think you are the only economist, qualified Masters, or Ph.d about. Hate to burst your bubble friend, there are many Ivy league types here too. Teaching me about economics, what did you do a semester of classes, an hour a week. I bet, you spent 10 hours total on this in your major. Supply and Demand- hilarious!!!!!!!!!!!!Ceteris Paribus amigo, ceteris paribus.
I think Uni salaries are too low, """"""","""""""","""""""""""
"Ne illegitimi carborundum te."- How old are you ???30s?
Quoting random Latin, spending time online looking up obscure economic principals...
I must have really gotten you riled up. Asking my age, letting me in on the best kept secret in Korea(people with masters are teaching here)...
You just reminded me of this old poster who quoted Latin, I will have to look that up... you know if can take some time out of my busy schedule translating the two quotes you gave me...
Are you the guy at the end of the bar in the old leather jacket and worn out trucker hat? You know the one, holes in your jeans, a tear in your bear...
ML condition is an obscure principle????? Ignorant person. In truth, I'm the guy at the track, blowing my junk on horse no. 2, the one with the Aussie or Japanese jockey on it. Then driving home in a sports car and getting back in time to see the boys for sushi and beers. Afterwards, getting to the Paradise Casino ; getting as pissed as possible. Then, If I'm flush; having some fun in a Noray ju joint. Hope you don't mind. Trying to set a good example for all of the good people out there .If you earn more, you can spend more. Don't accept peanuts. Some people save, some collect peanuts at the bar, I have fun, and as much as I can get. Portrait of a profligate.
That's an illusion. Should you be fortunate to have a block of classes, then yes, you are correct.
So... What is supposed to mean "part dieux" anyway?
Look up Charlie Sheen.Lt. Sean "Topper" Harley
Angel I feel your pain. Trying to support a family on the joke that these salaries are has become impossible and whilst a Korean professor will pull in over 60 million we are lucky to make half of that without extra work.
I believe the Korean government should start restricting E2's the way they restrict other visas, sorry no visa unless you can't find anyone here, I believe teachers should be paid a good salary, I believe I would rather wax myself than accept w25k per hour, and I find it unbelievable that people come here for the salary especially when exchange rates are factored in. Unfortunately what I believe doesn't matter.
In the last year I have had jobs paying between w28,000 per hour (an intensive) and w140,000 per hour, but let me assure you the w140,000/hour jobs are few and far between.
Our job is in the declining phase, if you look at Daves you will see that Korean job postings are diminishing all the time. The ESL market here will go the same way as Japan's ESL market. Still there but much smaller.
China is where the action is. If you like me can't move then you will need to start living more frugally or start doing something to secure your future. Whether that's starting a home school if you have an F visa, or another business or studying something so as to get another job here is your call.
Salaries suck, but they are getting applicants, so remember the old saying: "Pay peanuts, get monkeys" or "If you pretend to pay me, I'll pretend to work."
Good luck to us all.
First Clown:A pestilence on him for a mad rogue! 'a pour'd a flagonof Rhenish on my head once. This same skull, sir, was, sir,Yorick's skull, the King's jester.
Hamlet:This? [Takes the skull]
First Clown:E'en that.
Hamlet:Alas, poor Yorick! I knew him, Horatio, a fellow of infinitejest, of most excellent fancy. He hath bore me on his back athousand times, and now how abhorr'd in my imagination it is!My gorge rises at it.
Alas, the_business_ teacher; a voice of reason in a sea of clowns.
Comparing yourself to a Korean professor is problematic. Whilst I acknowledge that there are plenty of dodgy Korean professor's out there, they still need a PhD just to get their foot in the door and usually have to have published articles amongst other things. Unless you have a PhD and have published then I think you can't make a comparison. I've worked with a number of people at university whose highest qualification was a BA - not even a TESOL certificate. These days, however, it seems an MA is becoming the basic requirement. This is still a far way from having a PhD in the subject area you are teaching. Whilst I agree that salaries should still have increased and should be higher than what they currently are it's not that difficult to get some privates paying 50,000 an hour which is more than most people here deserve.
Looking at adjunct pay is a much more reasonable comparison for what English teachers do in Korea at Uni jobs.
However I also know people who have PhD's and their pay is much higher here.
Pathetically... I also (as I am sure all of us feel) feel that Uni's need to bring up the standard of pay. This thread went off the rails when the OP decided to make personal attacks rather than have a discussion... funny that they call these things "discussion boards"...
Don't feel the need to defend yourself Angel, I am not speaking to you, just talking to Trevor...
My last post on this.
The point I was trying to make with my earlier post is while the situation sucks, posting on here doesn't solve anything. I said I would rather wax myself than work for 25k an hour, well it looks like I will have to do my own Brazillian in the near future. I don't blame people for accepting low paying jobs, hungry people need to eat and I don't blame businesses for trying to minimise their costs, although "pennywise pound foolish" comes to mind for some. I just wonder why so many come here when there are better places to make money. The Middle East and China come to mind. I know some have to stay here, but with exchange rates and increasing costs, I wouldn't come here now.
I also accept the argument that you can't compare Korean professors to English instructors, yet they are always doing so, usually when complaining about how few office hours we do. I just wish that universities would accept that a teacher with a family will need to work more to earn more than w2.1 million.
Yes w50,000 an hour may seem a lot of money for what most English teachers do, but by doing these classes you are in fact running a business. That means that the w50,000 per hour isn't income it's revenue, from which you must deduct expenses. The system is very inefficient, a teacher prepares a class, drives for 1 hour, teaches a class and the drives to their next class which in Busan traffic is always about 1 hour away. Three + hours for w50,000 isn't that high.
Anyway posting on here won't fix the system, and most of the recruiters know who we are, so the more we complain the less work we get.
I can only speak for myself, but I need to secure my family's future. Starting a business could do that, further study could do that, posting on here won't do that.
Peace and good luck to all.
"If you pretend to pay me, I'll pretend to work."- maybe this has seeped into the psyche of some here. Great quote, sadly, labeling is rife throughout Education here. What happens when you meet all of the criteria for tenure?(ie you're a citizen and have the right documents)
There are tenured and tenure track foreign professors in Busan and probably many more in Seoul. So if you meet all the criteria it is possible to become tenure track. Or by citizen did you mean Koreans? Since technically we aren't citizens but residents.
Fall in love with your New Vision
with BGN SMILE
ReLEx SMILE / LASIK / LASEK / ICL
BGN Eye Hospital